16 June 2004 - Wednesday
Cute
All right, politics fans. Let's review.
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.With that out of the way, let's talk about the meaning of the term defamation. | Posted by Wilson at 14:34 Central | TrackBackConstitution of the United States, Article III, Section II.
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"The same overt Act" closes the loophole.
The thoughts of Wilson on 16 June 2004 - 20:45 Central+ + + + +
Don't think that closes anything at all. Whatever counts as "adhering to their enemies" will also count if two people witness it.
You and I may dread the idea that saying "I love Uncle Ho" in public, with enthusiasm, might suffice for treason if two people will say in court that we did it and they witnessed it, but if we deny this is "adhering" to an enemy of the United States, what will we say if some mad judge says we're full of beans, and yes it is?
The thoughts of Marcus Tullius Cicero on 17 June 2004 - 20:16 Central+ + + + +
I'm not sure I follow your run-on at all. However, my emphasis was on "overt," not on the two witnesses. In other words, I read the Constitution as stipulating that "adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort" must involve an "overt act"; opinions and speech do not count.
The thoughts of Wilson on 17 June 2004 - 21:08 Central+ + + + +
How is a public declaration not overt?
The thoughts of Marcus Tullius Cicero on 19 June 2004 - 21:36 Central+ + + + +
Who says speech does not count? You? The last judge anybody asked? What will the next judge say?
That last was my point.
Anyway, I won't bother you again.
The thoughts of Marcus Tullius Cicero on 19 June 2004 - 21:38 Central+ + + + +
Well, not after I remind you of Axis Sal, Lord Haw Haw, and Ezra Pound, anyway.
The thoughts of Marcus Tullius Cicero on 19 June 2004 - 21:40 Central+ + + + +
It may be overt, but it's not an act. The Constitution makes a pretty clear distinction between speech and behavior. In any case:
One may think disloyal thoughts and have his heart on the side of the enemy. Yet if he commits no act giving aid and comfort to the enemy, he is not guilty of treason. He may on the other hand commit acts which do give aid and comfort to the enemy and yet not be guilty of treason, as for example where he acts impulsively with no intent to betray.
-- Kawakita v. United States (US Supreme Court, 1952)
The thoughts of Wilson on 19 June 2004 - 22:05 Central+ + + + +
Congress shall make no law . . . abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
Recognize that? It's the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America, and it says that I can call Osama Bin Laden a fine, upstanding citizen of the world, should I be so inclined.
The thoughts of Blame Jared on 19 June 2004 - 22:26 Central+ + + + +
Right up until the time a judge says it doesn't mean what all the world thinks it means.
The thoughts of Marcus Tullius Cicero on 20 June 2004 - 17:36 Central+ + + + +
Since when do conservatives take a relativistic view of the meaning of the Constitution?
The thoughts of Wilson on 20 June 2004 - 19:02 Central+ + + + +
Right up until the time a judge says it doesn't mean what all the world thinks it means.
That has got to be among the more irrelevant observations I have ever seen . . . I mean really. Idle and foolish speculation on whether "some judge" someday decides to rule that the first amendment doesn't allow freedom of speech has absolutely NOTHING to do with the fact that the so-called "Whistleblower's" assertion that Democrats are traitors is boorish (at best).
I cry obfuscation.
The thoughts of Blame Jared on 20 June 2004 - 22:21 Central+ + + + +
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"or in adhering to their enemies ..."
Drive a truck through that, I think.
Hey, we didn't write it.
The thoughts of Marcus Tullius Cicero on 16 June 2004 - 20:33 Central+ + + + +